Is the Antichrist Buried or Burned?

Antichrist appears to be buried in Ezek. 39 and Isa. 14, but the Beast is burned in Dan. 7 and Rev. 19. So is the Antichrist buried or burned or both?

This is among the most difficult to solve questions in Bible prophecy.

This article was written in response to a question by one of our readers. 

Is the Antichrist Buried or Burned?

We know that scripture is consistent and always true. So all of these passages must align somehow. Let’s examine all of them and find that truth.

On that day I will give Gog a burial ground there in Israel, the valley of those who pass by east of the sea, and it will block off those who would pass by. So they will bury Gog there with all his horde, and they will call it the valley of Hamon-gog. For seven months the house of Israel will be burying them in order to cleanse the land. (Ezek. 39:11-12)

Sheol (the grave) from beneath is excited over you to meet you when you come. . . Even you have been made weak as we, You have become like us. Your pomp and the music of your harps have been brought down to Sheol; Maggots are spread out as your bed beneath you and worms are your covering. (Isa. 14:9-11)

All the kings of the nations lie in glory, each in his own tomb. But you have been cast out of your tomb like a rejected branch, clothed with the slain who are pierced with a swordWho go down to the stones of the pit like a trampled corpse. You will not be united with them in burial, because you have ruined your country, You have slain your people. (Isa. 14:18-20)

These three passages are all attributed to the Antichrist and all show him being buried. These two additional verses show the Beast being burned:

Then I kept looking because of the sound of the boastful words which the horn was speaking; I kept looking until the beast was slain, and its body was destroyed and given to the burning fire. (Dan. 7:11)

And the beast was seized, and with him the false prophet who performed the signs in his presence, by which he deceived those who had received the mark of the beast and those who worshiped his image; these two were thrown alive into the lake of fire which burns with brimstone.  And the rest were killed with the sword which came from the mouth of Him who sat on the horse, and all the birds were filled with their flesh. (Rev. 19:20-21)

Are Gog and the Antichrist the Same Person?

I don’t think there is any question these passages are referring to different events: one a burial and one a burning. This is the opinion of almost everyone who studies this issue. The “simplistic” solution is that the person(s) buried in Isa. 14 and Ezek. 39 are not the Antichrist. That would solve all textual problems if it were true. But it isn’t true.

Joel Richardson has done extensive exegesis and shown that six events in Ezek. 38 & 39 show that the Gog/Magog War is Armageddon and Gog is the Antichrist. Here are those six events:

  • God’s name will never again be profaned (Ezekiel 39:7)
  • The surviving Gentile nations will come to a saving knowledge of God (Ezekiel 39:6-7)
  • The captives of Israel will be delivered (Ezekiel 39:25-28)
  • God will pour out His Spirit on Israel from that day forward (Ezekiel 39:29)
  • The survivors of Israel will come to know the LORD forevermore (39:22)
  • Israel will dwell securely in their land forevermore (Ezekiel 39:26-28)

I think everyone except the most hard-hearted will agree that these things can ONLY happen once in history; after the battle of Armageddon. This analysis clearly shows us that the Antichrist is buried because Gog is buried. And so we are back to our original dilemma.

What does VanKampen Say:

One of the Bible teachers who has most shaped my thinking on endtimes is the late Robert VanKampen.  This is what he had to say in his book “The Sign” about the issue:

“This powerful world ruler (Antichrist) will be buried, but more importantly he will be cast out of his tomb like a rejected branch.” RVK

Van Kampen’s suggestion is that the Antichrist is first buried and then resurrected to be thrown alive into the Lake of Fire. He bases this on Isa. 14:18-19.

All the kings of the nations lie in glory, each in his own tomb. But you have been cast out of your tomb like a rejected branch, clothed with the slain who are pierced with a sword. 

But VanKampen’s theory, however, is not what Isa. 14 says. Isa. 14 refers to the official tombs of kings which are commonly places of honor where the kings are wrapped in spices and formal death clothes. This is what the passage refers to when it says the kings lie in glory. But it says Antichrist will not have a tomb of honor, he was cast out. Rather it says he will be clothed with the slain. In other words he will be thrown into a mass grave and be surrounded with other dead bodies.

What Does Richardson Say:

Joel Richardson is my mentor and has had more to do with my development as a bible teacher than any other. He is also the one who has done more research on Gog than any recent theologian. So I always respect his opinions and usually he and I agree.  Here is what he has to say on this matter:

In light of the full range of Scriptural evidence, we see that the Antichrist will both be killed and his body buried in a mass grave, covered with the bodies of others who were slain. We must therefore conclude that the reference in Revelation 19:20 to the beast being cast alive into hell is a reference to his being cast alive into hell after the resurrection of the wicked (Daniel 12:1-2) to consciously experience the torments of hell. The claim that the Antichrist cannot be the same as Gog because one is buried and the other thrown alive into hell is seen to be a fallacy that is not in accordance with Scripture.-JR

I agree with all of this except Joel’s conclusion. It is obvious from both Dan. 7 and Rev. 19 that the burning occurs prior the Millennial Kingdom and prior to the Resurrection of the Wicked that takes place after the Kingdom. Although this is the best guess yet, is there yet another possibility?

Can the Beast and Antichrist be separate and yet the same?

Let’s look at Daniel 7 because it refers to both the Little Horn AND the Beast as if they are separate entities.

Then I kept looking because of the sound of the boastful words which the horn was speaking; I kept looking until the beast was slain, and its body was destroyed and given to the burning fire. (Dan. 7:11)

I think this passage is the key to understanding this most challenging of mysteries. It is the general consensus of most theologians that the  “Little Horn” of Dan. 7 is the Antichrist and also that the Beast of Revelation is the Antichrist. I agree and I disagree. In THIS FORMER ARTICLE, I suggest a theory that the Beast is actually a 3-part entity: a man and a demon and an empire; and that  in Daniel 7 this one verse refers to both the man (Little Horn) and the demon (the Beast).

If the “Little Horn” and the Beast are separate entities, they can suffer separate fates. This is a key understanding.

Do Rev. 19 and Dan. 7 Contradict?

Now Revelation 19 says that the Beast is thrown alive into the Lake of fire, and Dan. 7 implies he is slain first. However, the original Aramaic (Dan. 7 was written in Aramaic) states it this way:

I saw how that creature was killed, how her body went to oblivion and was delivered into the fiery furnace.

This is a different take on that verse isn’t it? Going into oblivion and the fiery furnace are explanations of how the Beast was slain. This does not say the creature was slain first.

Summary

The best explanation seems to be that the man (the Antichrist or Beast) is buried in a mass grave after Armageddon. The demon (The Beast which comes out of the abyss and possesses the man Antichrist) is thrown alive into the Lake of Fire immediately after Armageddon. They are two separate entities with separate fates.

The secret to uncovering this understanding is realizing the demonic nature of the Antichrist and False Prophet; that the “Beasts” that possess the men during the 70th Week are demonic spirits. The world will see what appear to be men but which are really both demonically possessed and empowered individuals.

 

 

49 thoughts on “Is the Antichrist Buried or Burned?”

  1. Nelson, You said: “Does Islamic eschatology support an Islamic Antichrist position? Yes”.

    That’s correct. And if it wasn’t so we wouldn’t be having this debate, because that’s where the Mideast beast cult was born.

    I can’t recall the exact year this idea came on the prophecy scene, but I do recall it was the Mahdi of Islamic eschatology that inspired it all. That was several years before Richardson got the backing of WND which pushed his book into the best sellers. The link below shows it was being discussed at least as far back as 2007.

    https://gracethrufaith.com/ask-a-bible-teacher/is-king-abdullah-the-anti-christ/

    As I said previously. In the beginning the tail was being pinned on King Abdullah ll of Jordan. Later on Richardson came up with some as yet unnamed Turk for a candidate. This idea is also based solely on Islamic eschatology, and only looks to the Bible to claim various passages for support. But if the foundation is a lie, everything else is twisted by that lie.

    This is why I say your questions to me are based on a false premise. That premise being that there is any foundational truth on which the Mideast beast is built.

    Of course you can find scripture that appears to support this Islam based hogwash. Prophetic scripture is often cryptic, so it can appear to mean all kinds of things. But one thing is for sure. If you use Islamic eschatology for inspiration, you are allowing the father of lies to be your guide.

    1. Phil, do you realize you are doing EXACTLY what you accuse these men of doing? Using none biblical sources to argue a biblical issue!! The only thing that matters is what the bible says and you didn’t reference a single bible verse. Who cares were certain people got there idea for a theory? All that matters is the biblical evidence. And that evidence strongly points to a Middle Eastern (not necessarily Islamic) Antichrist.

  2. Harvos, seeing as you are willing to consider issues that are expanded in books other than biblical canon. A thing that Nelson has long ago declared himself unwilling to do. You may be able to understand that Gog is a product of what is described in Genesis 6 and expanded on by Enoch. He is a man, but his spirit is that of a demon, hence his ability to die then appear again later in history.

      1. I was speaking of Genesis 6. ‘Nephilim’. But given your rejection of the obvious implications of that passage, you would be unlikely to see the connection.

        If it wasn’t so serious it would be laughable that you display such caution toward non canon books that are referred to in the Bible, whilst swallowing hook, line and sinker the teaching of the Mideast Beast cult, that has its origins in Islamic eschatology.

        1. Islamic eschatology is not the basis of any “Islamic Antichrist” teaching. How foolish. Have you read Mideast Beast? It is Bible based teaching. Cults obscure the divinity of Jesus, it is no more a cult than “European Antichrist” theories are. Both are theories not fact at this point.

          1. That is absolute garbage. I was there when the Islamic Antichrist theory was first put forward. It was influenced by Islamic eschatology dealing with their Mahdi.
            They tried to pin the tail on a Hashemite prince. The switch to Turkey simply came from another school of thought within Islamic eschatology.

            If you are genuinely unaware of those facts you need to check it out. You are promoting a lie.

          2. Does Islamic eschatology support an Islamic Antichrist position? Yes, but as you state, it isn’t scripture. I find it interesting just as Enoch and Jubilees are interesting, but not scripture. However, have you read the seminal document on the Islamic Antichrist position: Mideast Beast? You didn’t answer that question. I choose to argue from the Bible.

    1. I also believe we have been too willing to ignore all the OT manuscripts. Some differences may cause some to lose faith, but I see it as an addition. Here is Gog mentioned in Amos 7 in the LXX:

      Amos 7:1 LXX Thus has the Lord God shewed me; and, behold, a swarm of locusts coming from the east; and, behold, one caterpillar, king Gog. 2 And it came to pass when he had finished devouring the grass of the land, that I said, Lord God, be merciful; who shall raise up Jacob? for he is small in number. 3 Repent, O Lord, for this. And this shall not be, saith the Lord.

      Just we read in Ezekiel, Gog does not succeed in devouring Israel. Confirmed here in Amos. That simple means Gog cannot be the AC as most assume. The AC does devour Israel. Gog does not. Big difference!

      As far as Gog being both man and demon is very perceptive my friend. Psalm 82 describes the first act of Jesus after coming before the Father to receive the kingdoms, as shown in Daniel 7. The wicked angelic authorities are judged. Then Michael casts them to the earth. Notice the judgment in Psalm 82. They will die as men! It is the ultimate role reversal. The wicked angels become flesh and perish while righteous men become like the angels in heaven. This is the real Replacement Theology!

      1. Harvos, please be careful in ascribing things to the Bible that aren’t there. Ezek. 38 and 39 does not say that Gog is not successful in his invasion. It doesn’t mention the effects of the invasion at all. We know (though you disagree) that the invasion of Ezek. 38 occurs at the midpoint, so this is the invasion of the AC.

        The LXX is the bible, and in my mind just as reliable as the Hebrew texts. There is a difference between this and other non-canonical books which are interesting, that are an adjunct, but shouldn’t be taken as the Word of God and inerrant.

        As for Gog being man and demon, you know that my opinion is that the AC is man possessed by a demon. Do they have the same name here – Gog? Maybe.

        1. Where exactly does it say Gog conquers Israel in Ezekiel? It doesn’t. In fact, it says this:

          Ezekiel 39:2 and I will turn you around and lead you on, bringing you up from the far north, and bring you against the mountains of Israel. 3 Then I will knock the bow out of your left hand, and cause the arrows to fall out of your right hand.

          That doesn’t sound like a successful invasion, yet you have to assume to make your theory work.. It isn’t up to me to prove what Gog does over and above what is written. That is up to those who claim he is the AC. I cannot probe something that does not exist.

          If you really believe the LXX is legit, why do you dismiss the Amos passage I provided that plainly states Gog will not succeed in devouring Israel?

          As far as the “mid point,” if people only knew that the false hope of the 7 year trib theory is the very cause of the falling away and the loss of many many souls, they’d be ashamed. But, what is written is written. People have to dismiss Daniel 10-12 being sealed until the time of the end in order to jam all things into 7 years, giving false hope to many. It will have devastating effects.

          When the door is shut to the wedding, there is 45.5 years before Jesus returns again. That whole left behind generation will pass away, exactly as Jesus stated. Jesus prophesied, “If you do not believe I am He, you will die in your sins.” If He were to return in only seven years, there would be no one but little children in Israel. Forget the one year return teaching. Perhaps there will be time to undo this teaching after the Tishri 1, 2020 order to restore Jerusalem and the temple. Thus beginning the 7 weeks. If not, Peter told us.

          2 Peter 3:3 knowing this first: that scoffers will come in the last days, walking according to their own lusts, 4 and saying, “Where is the promise of His coming? For since the fathers fell asleep [at the rapture], all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation.”

          1. It has been proven from the multiple proofs in Ezek. 39 that Gog there is the AC. Now you have this theory that Ezek. 38 is a different epoch, after the Millennium. This is a much bigger stretch than trying to say Gog is successful in his invasion (which I agree, it doesn’t say). Since you continue in this, consider a few things. 1. there were no chapter divisions in OT times. This was one continual prophecy. 2. Notice the quoted phrases in chapter 39 from chapter 38 “remotest parts of the north and bring you against the mountains of Israel”. This is how the Bible identifies things as the same, thru quotes. 3. Also the quote in Ezek 39:17-20 is referred to in Rev. 19. Again, showing this is Armageddon.

            All of Dan. 10-12 isn’t 7 years. The Covenant with the many is signed in dan. 11:23. That is the start of the 7 years. I am not convinced that all of Dan. 11 is future (I think it is, but I’m not sure.) In Revelation Deciphered, I detail the 23 similarities and quotes between Dan. 8 and Dan. 11. None of these occur in the section Dan. 11:6-20, making me wonder about whether this section will be historic only.

            Your interpretation of 2 Pet. 3:3 is dangerously off base. The resurrection and rapture aren’t a falling asleep, its a coming to life. Quite the opposite. A visible resurrection and rapture isn’t all things continuing as they were from the creation either! The “coming” Peter mentions is parousia which is the rapture.

  3. Ezekiel 39 and 38 are two different prophecies separated by 1000 years. Ezekiel 39 is the Armageddon event soon to come. Ezekiel 38 is the end of the Millennium, as stated in Revelation 20:8. Therefore, Gog is not the AC, but satan himself. Satan is cast into the abyss at Christ’s coming after leading his people to their deaths at Armageddon, then released at the end of the Millennium to do it again. The abyss is located east of the Red Sea within the land of Israel. (The whole promised land of Israel to be realized when Jesus comes.)

    Revelation 20:8 gives problems for Premil until we realize 39 & 38 are separate events. Compare the two, 39 – All have wooden weapons. 38 – All have swords. This is explained in Enoch 52 referring to the Daniel 7 event when all metals will be removed from the earth on day one of the Beast. (I realize you don’t give credence to Enoch, though Jesus Himself called it scripture. I can explain if desired.)

    The Assyrian AC is trampled by Jesus at His coming. Isaiah 14:25. The Beast is cast alive into the LoF as you know.

    The beast that is burned in Daniel 7 is neither the AC or thee Beast. There are four beasts in Daniel 7, not one. It isn’t the 4th beast that gets burned. It is Leviathan, the third beast with four heads. Of course, these are impossible to understand until we realize beasts are beasts, not people. I challenge you to read Job 41 and the following.

    Psalm 74:14 You broke the HEADS (plural) of Leviathan in pieces, And gave him as food to the people inhabiting the wilderness.

    Isaiah 26:21 For behold, the Lord comes out of His place
    To punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity;… 27:1 In that day the Lord with His severe sword, great and strong, Will punish Leviathan the fleeing serpent, Leviathan that twisted serpent; And He will slay the reptile that is in the sea.

    The biggest piece most everyone is missing is the fact that the entire 1260 days of the Beast come AFTER Jesus has returned to the Mount of Olives and His people have flown into the wilderness (not rapture). Rev 11-13, the 7th trumpet. No one seems to understand this though Jesus Himself said the days of tribulation will be cut short for the elect’s sake. But, not for the wicked. They continue another 1260 days outside His wall of fire. Daniel 12:1 and Isaiah 16:1-4 tell the exact same story as Revelation 11-13. Jesus comes and rescues the elect, everyone in the book, and THEN the real horror begins. The Beast is not the AC. The Beast is a whole other deal. The book of Revelation makes this plain, yet no one seems to see it. The whole body of scripture supports this. I can lay out all the evidence in an email if you would like.

    1. Harvos, we will not agree on these matters I’m sure. Enoch is interesting, but one must trust the spirit of God that prevailed over the fallen men that chose the canon of scripture. Enoch was considered but rejected. God’s Spirit reigned over that meeting and vote. If you don’t believe that, then the Bible is what you make it for yourself and not God’s Word.

      Leviathan is it the Beast of Revelation or the Dragon of Revelation? I think one or the other but not the leopard. That is an entirely different animal. Both the Beast and Dragon each have 7 heads.

      Your theory about Ezek 39 being after the 1000 years makes no sense to me.

      v23 speaks of Israel in captivity-that doesn’t happen at the end of the 1000 years, its before the 1000 years
      vv17-20 speak of the feast of the birds which is referenced in Rev19 and is prior to the 1000 years
      vv7-8 says Jesus will not allow his name to be profaned again. your theory would say it is profaned during the 1000 years and Jesus allows it.
      v22 says the house of Israel will know Jesus is Lord from that day on, that happens before the 1000 years not after
      v29 says Jesus will not hide his face from Israel any longer. This is prior to the 1000 years as well.

      Your theory seems based on “wood” weapons. But the text doesn’t say that, it only says they were burned for fuel. You assume they are wood.

      1. Apparently you did read my post carefully. I did not say Ez 39 is after the 1000 years. I said just the opposite. Ez 39 is before the 1000 year and 38 is after the 1000 years.

        Also, Ez 39 says they do not gather wood from the forests because they are burning the weapons. Does iron burn? Hardly. If you do not understand Enoch 52 this will not make sense.

        As to Enoch not being in the cannon, which you claim was selected by God, I disagree. If God chose the cannon then He is divided against Himself because there are multiple cannons. Each group believes only theirs is correct, which is arrogant and ignorant. Man decided what he could believe and what he couldn’t which has changed over time. Does God’s word expire?

        There are two points Jesus made that should cause us to learn. One, Jesus expected Nicodemus to understand the concept of being born again since he was a teacher of Israel. This concept does not appear in our current Bibles. It does appear in Enoch.

        Two, Matthew 22:29 Jesus answered and said to them, “You are mistaken, not knowing the Scriptures…30 For in the resurrection they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels of God in heaven.

        The Saducees question Jesus about resurrection and marriage in the afterlife. Each issue is addressed by Jesus separately. (No need to cover resurrection here.) The first issue is that there is no marriage in the afterlife and we become like angels. Jesus answered, “You are mistaken, NOT KNOWING THE SCRIPTURES.” Where is scripture is it written that angels do not marry and we become like angels in that regard? Nowhere. Yet, Jesus said it was in scripture. Only Enoch, as far as I know, covers this topic, and Jesus called it scripture. That is good enough for me. Study this carefully and you will see I am right.

        So, there are two things, being born again and lack of marriage in the afterlife, that Jesus expected people to know. One of which He said was in the scriptures directly. Both of which are only found in Enoch. It isn’t hard to put together. It is only a lack of faith in the radical stories of Enoch that make us appear weird to the world that cause us to say Enoch is no longer considered scripture, though most of the ECF’s considered it scripture and some churches still do. Was Jesus right about the scriptures, or is the church right? It is up to you to decide.

        1. I will try to answer your questions one at a time Harvos. These are all good questions.

          First in regard to Ezek. 38 and 39. Is it possible 38 will be fulfilled at Armageddon and part 1000 years later in a near/far fulfillment? I don’t see why not, but the primary fulfillment is Armageddon. Look at these verses which can only be fulfilled at Armageddon:

          Ezek. 38:16 “I will bring you against My land, so that the nations may know Me when I am sanctified through you before their eyes, O Gog.” At the end of the 1000 years, Jesus has reigned over them as King. The obviously already know him. This can only be fulfilled at Armageddon.

          Ezek. 38:17 “Are you the one of whom I spoke in former days through My servants the prophets of Israel, who prophesied in those days for many years that I would bring you against them?” The prophets spoke of Antichrist, not some Millennial ruler.

          Ezek. 38:23 “I will magnify Myself, sanctify Myself, and make Myself known in the sight of many nations; and they will know that I am the Lord.” Again, after the 1000 years Jesus is already known by the nations. This cannot be a reference to that millennial time.

          In terms of the two things you say Jesus could have only gotten from Enoch, this is not true. These items are in the OT.

          In Gen. 6:1-4, the sin of the watchers is explained in greatly abbreviated form from Enoch, but the sin of angels marrying is there. This is not only in Enoch.

          In terms of regeneration in the OT, The New Covenant is there mentioned in Jer. and Ezek where God promises to give them a new heart. Also in Daniel we see OT saints raising in the resurrection of the righteous including Daniel. Obviously Jesus’s blood was applied to them based on their faith in advance of his death. So Jesus could easily expect Nicodemus to understand being born again.

          Sorry, but I have to say Jesus and the Spirit are right. The choice of excluding Enoch was a God thing IMO. However, that doesn’t mean there aren’t some aspects of it that are inspired. Obviously Jude quotes it and Peter alludes to it.

          1. On Ezekiel 38, every issue you raise is an assumption. I once believed the same thing. There are too many differences between the two chapters to dismiss. Assuming “the nations will know me” comes only at the beginning of the Millennium misses the fact that 99.999% of the people alive at that time never witnessed any part of this age, God’s wrath, or Jesus glorious coming. Jesus was known in the eyes of Israel when they fled Egypt a long time ago. That doesn’t mean today’s Israel knows Him. We never saw these things. We’ve only heard/read about them. Jesus coming will be a whole new deal for a whole new batch of people. The same is true for Ezekiel 38 and 39 1000 years apart. People forget and drift away. 1000 years is plenty of time for that. Who do you think satan recruits at the end of the Millennium if the nations all still know Him? On top of that, Revelation 20:8 plainly puts Gog Magog at the end of the Millennium.

            Rev 20:7 Now when the thousand years have expired, Satan will be released from his prison 8 and will go out to deceive the nations which are in the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle

            You really cannot be Premil and believe Ezekiel 38 and 39 are both before the Millennium. It doesn’t add up. If you can see this, it only leaves one option for who Gog is, satan. He is the only one who comes against Israel at each end of the Millennium. This has a major implications, which I will email you. You’ll like it I believe. It proves beyond doubt you are on the right track with Islam.

            Enoch. The question you answered wasn’t the one asked. It isn’t about angels sinning. It is about how marriage in the after life works. Jesus said, “You are mistaken, not knowing the Scriptures nor the power of God. 30 For in the resurrection they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels of God in heaven. 31 But concerning the resurrection of the dead…”

            Where in scripture does it tell us angels do not marry AND we become like the angels, so as to draw the conclusion we will not marry in the resurrection? These two facts must be in scripture according to Jesus. That is the only way to draw the conclusion Jesus made about us not marrying in the resurrection. Both of these are in what Jesus called scripture, but they are not our Bibles.

            Your answer as to resurrection in OT is noted. I agree, but that wasn’t the issue. Jesus answered that part separately in the following verse in Matthew 22:31-32. Resurrection and marrying in the afterlife are two separate issues which Jesus answers separately. There is a text somewhere that does tell us angels do not marry AND we become like angels. Jesus called that text scripture. The only one I know is Enoch.

            Last point. Where in scripture is the concept of being born again? Jesus expected Nicodemus to already know this in John 3, yet it isn’t in our OT. It is in Enoch. That makes two subjects Jesus either expected a teacher of Israel to know or He directly called scripture that didn’t make it into our Bibles. I realize you may not want to rock the boat of the cannon and the church authorities. But, for your sake, examine these things I pointed out and you will put a lot more trust in Enoch. It fits with Revelation like a glove. Some of the Revelation symbols are only found in Enoch. For example, the great burning mountain in the 2nd trumpet. Enoch tells us what/who it is.

          2. Harvos, Jesus is on the earth reigning as king for a thousand years. Everyone will know him. Some will reject him, but all will know him. But the statement about being the one the prophets foretold would come against you is obviously the Assyrian, the Antichrist. And that is not the Millennial foe.

            In terms of Rev. 20:8, I’ve been discussing this on another blog article’s comments with another person. This verse is talking about nations NOT the return of Gog, the man. “nations which are in the four corners of the earth, THE Gog and Magog, . . .” The phrases “which are in the four corners of the earth” and “the Gog and Magog” are both acting to define “nations.” Also notice that English translators have neglected to translate the definitive article “the” in the verse because it didn’t make sense in their theology. John isn’t saying Gog comes back, he says the original nations that participated in Armageddon will rise against Jesus again in the 1000 years. John terms these nations “the Gog and Magog.” It is a symbolic use of language rather than list out all the nations. He is referring us back to those original nations.

            I showed in my last comment that both of your suggestions about Enoch being scripture are contained in the canon. Mark 12:24 shows the heart of the discussion is the Sadducees not knowing what the Bible says about resurrections not marriage in the afterlife. Gen. 6:1-4 clearly shows that it is a sin for angels to marry. So both of these topics are covered. However, I am interested in what Enoch says about this topic. What is the reference?

            Being born again is the same. The New Covenant in Jeremiah and Ezekiel clearly show a new heart, which is the same concept. But what is the Enoch reference so I can compare.

            Enoch was not written by a 4th century fellow as most Christian’s say because Jude clearly says it was written by the 7th from Adam. But do we have the original? The Ethiopian document is what our current book is based on. How accurate is it? Has it been added to? Is this why the Holy Spirit did not see fit to include it in the canon? I don’t know, but that is what I suspect. So I view Enoch as interesting and an adjunct to understanding, but not canon, not scripture. But areas where it is quoted and areas where it coincides with the canon are most valuable.

            There is an interesting possibility that it was canon in Jesus’s day and not now based on the document we have. Have you considered that?

  4. You wrongly assume that I had read your mentors thesis or the Sept 2015 article. If I had I would have dealt with his eisegesis at the time.

    1.) 39:7. This is the return of Israel to the religion as practiced by them during the days of the last Temple. It is not an acceptance of Christ. Proven by the reintroduction of animal sacrifice.

    2. 39:6-7. Richardson introduces a concept that isn’t found in the narrative. It doesn’t say “THE ONE AND ONLY TRUE GOD”.
    Men and nations have in the past acknowledge the God of Israel whilst still serving other gods. So this isn’t SALVATION OF THE NATIONS as he claims.

    3.) 39:25-28. This is merely the product of Richardson’s biblical illiteracy. The Jews return to Israel for their appointment with Daniel’s 70th week. Why can it only be when Jesus returns? They have been returning to Israel for over 70 years already.

    4.) 39:29. It is clear from scripture that there is an outpouring of the Holy Spirit during the Tribulation period. Not only at the time of Christ’s return.

    5.) 39:22. If that was the correct understanding there could never be any salvation for anyone prior to Christ’s return.

    6.) 39:26-28. Richardson’s conclusions ignore the fact that there will be an end time attack on God’s people (Rev 20:7-10). And what do we see there? The beast and the false prophet are in the lake of fire, whilst Gog is clearly named as a different entity.

    I put this rebuttal together in just thirty minutes, so it’s by no means the result of an in depth study of Richardson’s claims as opposed to scriptural facts. But just that #6 point alone is enough to prove Gog and the Antichrist are different entities.

    You have stunted your spiritual growth by running after false teachers who are motivated by book sales rather than the search for truth.

    1. Let’s look at the passages and your response:

      1. Ezek. 39:7 “My holy name (Yeshua) I will make known in the midst of My people Israel; and I will not let My holy name be profaned anymore.”
      YOUR RESPONSE – “39:7. This is the return of Israel to the religion as practiced by them during the days of the last Temple. It is not an acceptance of Christ. Proven by the reintroduction of animal sacrifice.”

      Phil hopefully you see Ezek. 39:7 has zero to do with return to sacrifice. It has ONLY to do with God’s Holy Name which is profaned right up until Antichrist is defeated at Armageddon (Dan. 7:11-12). Your answer is totally inadequate. There is no time prior to Armageddon when Jesus will not permit God’s name to be profaned again. Even if they try to profane it in the second Gog/Magog war, Jesus immediately eliminates the blasphemers.

      2. Ezek. 39:7b – “And the nations will know that I am the Lord, the Holy One IN Israel.”
      YOUR RESPONSE: “Richardson introduces a concept that isn’t found in the narrative. It doesn’t say “THE ONE AND ONLY TRUE GOD”. Men and nations have in the past acknowledge the God of Israel whilst still serving other gods. So this isn’t SALVATION OF THE NATIONS as he claims.”

      Phil, this says the nations will “know that I am the Lord.” They don’t know this now, but at Armageddon they will all know it. Salvation isn’t necessary. Knowing he is God is what this says. Also this says he is the Holy One IN Israel, not “of”. He is on the ground. This only happens after Armageddon. This phrase “Holy One IN Israel” is only found here in Ezek 39:7b. Again your answer is totally inadequate.

      3. Ezek. 39:25-28 – “Therefore thus says the Lord God, “Now I will restore the fortunes of Jacob and have mercy on the whole house of Israel; and I will be jealous for My holy name. They will forget their disgrace and all their treachery which they perpetrated against Me, when they live securely on their own land with no one to make them afraid. When I bring them back from the peoples and gather them from the lands of their enemies, then I shall be sanctified through them in the sight of the many nations. Then they will know that I am the Lord their God because I made them go into exile among the nations, and then gathered them again to their own land; and I will leave none of them there any longer.”
      YOUR RESPONSE “This is merely the product of Richardson’s biblical illiteracy. The Jews return to Israel for their appointment with Daniel’s 70th week. Why can it only be when Jesus returns? They have been returning to Israel for over 70 years already.”

      Richardson isn’t the one practicing illiteracy here. Jesus said, “they will fall by the edge of the sword, and will be led captive into all the nations; and Jerusalem will be trampled under foot by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.” (Luke 21:24) Jerusalem will be taken captive and trampled until the time of the Gentiles is fulfilled. This is at Armageddon. Only then will Jesus leave “none of them there any longer” as Ezek. 39:28 states. Again, the finality of all the passages in Ezek. 39 leaves no doubt it is Armageddon. Again your answer is totally inadequate.

      I will answer the other three in the next post.

      1. I. This is typical. You deliberately ignore facts you are fully aware of in order to create an argument that you wouldn’t support under other circumstances. You know as well as I that Israel reinstitutes Temple worship and animal sacrifice during the Tribulation period. And therefore cannot be accepting Yeshua at that point. It dose not say “my Holy name Yeshua”, that is your eisegesis. They are returning to their situation prior to their rejection of Christ. And in that state they will go through the 70th week until they finally acknowledge Christ as their saviour.

        2. That is simply a product of your inability to realise this is not speaking of Armageddon. Your answer to point #3 is the same.

        Don’t bother to try to win the debate on aggregate. Answer the point I made concerning Gog still being around 1000 years after the Antichrist was thrown in the lake of fire. If you can’t come up with an answer that has scriptural support, rather than just one of your opinions, you should rethink your support for Richardson’s silly ideas.

        1. First Phil, I can’t believe this is your answer to my response. It doesn’t answer anything. Nothing. Answer this one point directly: WHEN does God no longer permit His Holy Name to be profaned (Ezek. 39:7)?

          Second, I clearly answered you about why Gog is NOT around 1000 years after Antichrist. I will try to explain this to you again. Let’s look at Rev. 20:7-8 LINGUISTICALLY.
          “Satan will be released from his prison and will come out to deceive the nations which are in the four corners of the earth, [the] Gog and Magog.”
          SUBJECT: Satan
          COMPOUND PREDICATE: will be released, will come out to deceive the nations

          “Nations” is then clarified by a prepositional phrase “in the four corners of the earth” and two nouns “the Gog and Magog” (notice the article “tov (the)” is not translated in most translations). “The Gog and Magog” is the symbolic name given to these nations. This refers the reader back to the list of nations in Ezek. 38 and the Battle of Armageddon. In no way does this say some demon named Gog returns to fight for Satan. If he was fighting in this battle, why isn’t he punished like the Beast, the False Prophet, and Satan? Gog is never mentioned again.

          And in terms of “winning in the aggregate,” ALL of the Bible is true, you must answer ALL of Richardson’s points adequately. You haven’t answered one.

          1. Debating with you is like trying to herd cats. How many times have you referred to the principal of ‘first use’ when claiming justification for your interpretation of scripture? And now here you are performing linguistic gymnastics again. But this time it’s to argue against that principal you previously argued vehemently for.

            Never letting the truth get in the way of your preconceptions!

          2. Obviously you are unable or unwilling to answer the question I asked. Phil you are are king of Linguistic gymnastics.

            However, I will not avoid your question. “Gog” is a name not a symbolic word like “bow,” etc. The law of primacy involves symbols not names. Multiple characters in scripture share the same names. For instance, King Saul and the Apostle Paul shared the same name. Names are treated differently, obviously. Gog appears in Ezek. as the leader of the horde attacking Israel. This is not a symbol,but an actual name. Only in Revelation is the name used symbolically to describe a group of NATIONS as the text clearly states. That is also why they are called “THE Gog and Magog”. One never refers to a person as “the” Phil. That’s not a name. Now to further explain why Gog is not a demon is that he is killed and clearly buried in Ezek. 39. Demons are either thrown into the abyss (Luke 8:31) or into the lake of fire. They aren’t buried.

    2. Second part of my answer to your response to Richardson’s points.

      4. Ezek. 39:29 – “I will not hide My face from them any longer, for I will have poured out My Spirit on the house of Israel,” declares the Lord God.”
      YOUR RESPONSE – “It is clear from scripture that there is an outpouring of the Holy Spirit during the Tribulation period. Not only at the time of Christ’s return.”

      There is an outpouring of the Holy Spirit during the 70th Week. But Israel doesn’t SEE Jesus’s face until he comes on the clouds as depicted in Matt. 24:30 and Rev. 6:16. In that later verse we note the whole world sees Jesus’s face and hides.

      5. Ezek. 39:22 – “And I will set My glory among the nations; and all the nations will see My judgment which I have executed and My hand which I have laid on them. And the house of Israel will know that I (Jesus) am the Lord their God from that day onward.”
      YOUR RESPONSE – “If that was the correct understanding there could never be any salvation for anyone prior to Christ’s return.”

      The entire house of Israel only knows Jesus is Lord after their salvation when all Israel is saved. Your response is inadequate again.

      6. Ezek. 39:26 – “They will forget their disgrace and all their treachery which they perpetrated against Me when they live securely on their own land with no one to make them afraid.”
      YOUR RESPONSE – “Richardson’s conclusions ignore the fact that there will be an end time attack on God’s people (Rev 20:7-10). And what do we see there? The beast and the false prophet are in the lake of fire, whilst Gog is clearly named as a different entity.”

      Notice this is the one point of Richardson’s that doesn’t include words like “forever,” “ever again,” etc. in the Bible verse. It says they will forget their former treachery when they live securely. It doesn’t say they live securely forever. When has Israel forgotten its treachery?

      Your final comment is disturbing “I put this rebuttal together in just thirty minutes, so it’s by no means the result of an in depth study of Richardson’s claims as opposed to scriptural facts. But just that #6 point alone is enough to prove Gog and the Antichrist are different entities.” No Phil, God’s Word is consistent and you must be able to answer points 1-5. You can’t just claim to know one answer and think you have the solution.

      Now let me explain why you are even incorrect about Rev. 20:7-10. Here is what verses 7 and 8 have to say: “Satan will be released from his prison, and will come out to deceive the nations which are in the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together for the war.” The verse does not say “Gog” is still active on the earth or refer to him as a person or a demon. It uses the term “Gog” as a nation, as a description of physical locations where these nations are that will be coming against Jerusalem. They are the same nations that came against Jerusalem 1000 years previously in the “Gog and Magog” war. This would be like describing the Axis Powers in WWII as “Hitler and Germany.” It is a shorthand way of describing all the allied nations of the Gog/Magog war. If Gog were truly an active demon at that point, why isn’t he mentioned as being judged and thrown into the lake of fire like Satan is after Jesus wins the war??? The obvious answer is because he died 1000 years earlier and was buried.

      1. Answering a question that has a false premise is pointless.

        Magog is a descendant of Noah. ‘Magog’ is a national name that can be reasonably applied to his descendants. (Scythians, Irish, Scottish, some Swedish, Ukrainians, Russians, Moldovians, Polish, and most Slavic speaking people.

        Nowhere is there scriptural justification for claiming that ‘Gog’ is anything other than an individual, whether man or demon. Your ‘app’ is once again leading you astray!

        Also note that the Magog do not inhabit the lands you claim Antichrist comes from. Therefore Gog is not the Antichrist.

        1. Naturally I disagree with everything in this post. I do not support the idea that prophetic nations refer to people groups. Rather I believe they refer to land mass areas, the area the prophet would have thought that area refers to. Migration and intermarriage has completely blurred all people group distinctions making this idea nonsense. There is no such thing as “the Magog” anymore.

          1. If that was the case there would be no truth in the claims of the descendants of Abraham through Jacob/Israel. However that truth is established fact. Just as Mitochondrial DNA is an established fact which I already showed you blows your uninformed beliefs out of the water.

          2. Maternal mitochondrial DNA is not a means of Hebraic descent. If it was, Jesus would be a Moabite (Ruth). If you notice in Matt. 1, Jesus’s line of descent is through the Fathers.

        2. So what is the false premise of this question that you claim?

          “Answer this one point directly: WHEN does God no longer permit His Holy Name to be profaned (Ezek. 39:7)?”

          Please answer this question if you can

  5. I am busy with other matters at the moment, but I will try to give time to answering your challenge. However, you haven’t offered any justification for contradicting Rev 13:18. Answering my rebuttal with a challenge is nothing more than an attempt avoid the fact that scripture itself says you’re wrong!

    1. Phil, I will first answer your question. The Beast is a man . . . and a demon and an empire. The symbol has three components and the explanation is found HERE. In fact if you carefully read Rev. 13:18, why does the verse make a specific point about saying 666 is the number of a man. If the Beast were soley a man, wouldn’t that be the obvious conclusion without having to state it? If the Beast is solely a man, why in Dan. 7 does the little horn and the other ten horns appear ON the Beast? In Rev. 11 why does the Beast arise out of the abyss which is a holding area for demons not humans (humans are referred to as being in Sheol in scripture after death). Therefore, Rev. 13:18 states 666 is the number of the human component of the Beast so as not to confuse the reader.

      1. You stated that the beast and the man are two separate entities with separate fates. That is in contradiction to what we read in Rev 20:7-10, which tells us the antichrist and false prophet are in the lake of fire, but Gog is at large on the earth. If anything, that means that Gog is a demon whose human host was killed and buried in Israel. And that fact alone blows Richardson’s thesis out of the water.

        666 is not simply a human component, as you say. It’s a code through which we can identify him by name.

        1. Phil, you continue to make the same mistake of not addressing the primary issue (Is Gog Antichist?) saying you don’t have time, yet you continue to pursue this sideline issue.

          However, let’s continue to address your misconceptions: the Beast and Antichrist are not separate; the demon and man are separate. Both are contained within the symbol “the Beast.” The man is possessed by the demon.

          Second, Rev. 20:7-10 does not state the Antichrist is thrown in the lake of fire, it says the Beast is thrown alive into the lake. Most people make the same mistake you are making and ASSUME it means the human portion of the Beast. This portion of scripture doesn’t mention “Gog” at all, contrary to your statement.

          Third, in Ezek. 39:11 clearly states Gog is buried “on that day” (the day of Armageddon). Demons don’t have physical bodies and can’t be buried.

          Now your final point about Gog’s human host being buried is very close to what this article and my argument is saying. Except that the passage is saying Gog is buried. Gog is the name of the human host.

          1. So according to you Rev 20:7-10 doesn’t mention Gog at all. Which Bible are you reading from?

            7 When the thousand years are over, Satan will be released from his prison 8 and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth—Gog and Magog—and to gather them for battle. In number they are like the sand on the seashore. 9 They marched across the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of God’s people, the city he loves. But fire came down from heaven and devoured them. 10 And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

            And if you are claiming that the demon possessing the Antichrist is the only thing cast into the lake of fire, what are you claiming happens to the man himself? Me thinks you tie yourself in too many knots.

            Demons don’t have physical bodies, but the do take hosts. And it is the host I said was buried. The fact that Gog reappears a thousand years later is proof Gog is not the name of the human host. It’s the demonic entity.

          2. “And if you are claiming that the demon possessing the Antichrist is the only thing cast into the lake of fire, what are you claiming happens to the man himself?” -Phil

            He is resurrected after the 1000 years like all unrighteous humans and thrown into the lake of fire at that point.

    2. Second Phil, Joel Richardson’s 6 points about why Gog can only be the Antichrist first appeared on this blog in THIS ARTICLE from September, 2015 to which I have referred numerous times. When you read our current article a few days ago, you were confronted with these six points again. These points obviously contradict your view of “Gog.” Rather than stopping to FIRST examine and see if they were true, you simply ignored them, and instead looked beyond them for a reason to contradict Joel’s thesis. This seems to be a consistent pattern in all areas of your study on this site. This pattern may be hindering your growth.

  6. The is no secret to uncovering this understanding. We simply follow the scriptural facts to the correct conclusion.

    You and Richardson start from the opposite end, with a conclusion (Gog is the Antichrist) and desperately try to force scripture to fit. The result is a series of dead-ends. But rather than admit that there is no scriptural support for your ideas, you introduce another unscriptural concept. You declare the Beast to be a demonic spirit, in direct contradiction to Rev 13:18.

    “This calls for wisdom. Let the person who has insight calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a MAN.That number is 666.”

    1. Phil, this article presents Joel Richardson’s six reasons that Gog can only be the antichrist and that Ezek. 38-39 can only be Armageddon. Rather than pontificate on this by saying “there is no scriptural support” for this idea, I challenge you to address each and every one of these six points. Please show us how this event (Ezek. 38-39) can be anything other than Armageddon. I look forward to your thoughts

  7. Hello Nelson, I just want to say I am completely amazed at your Revelation Deciphered book and I am JUST now beginning to read chapter 4!! But chapter 3 truly helped me deeply understand the olivet discourse! I was reading the chapter in my break room at work and I can’t believe how overwhelmed I felt when I realized I was reading scripture the wrong way! It has truly blessed me so much that I read it with my wife and without a shadow of a doubt you truly debunk the pre and post trib theory! Your book is blessing me beyond you can imagine and I haven’t even finished the book!!

    I do have a question for you. According to Daniel chapter 8(goat and ram vision) Turkey is getting in conflict with Iran and destroy Iran to which the Antichrist will rise from that conflict and then begin the covenant with many and the tribulation period begins. What is your opinion on whats developing right now in the Middle east where Iran is using US’s defeat of ISIS to infiltrate the middle east and take over. Will that spill over into a regional war with Iran and Turkey which foreshadows the rise of Antichrist? What is your feel on what’s going on now and how close we are to seeing that conflict come to pass in the near future?

    1. Thanks for the kind words Catalyst. But it is the Spirit who really explains things to us.

      In regard to Dan. 8 (and this question is somewhat out of place here on this article), I have no idea when that war will begin. Mark Davidson has been writing about this subject for 7 or more years. If you go to his website, you’ll see articles that chronicle the history of those last 7 years about this topic. There are hundreds of times all of us have thought the war was ready to start only to see it didn’t. I have stopped trying to predict it and concentrate on presenting my testimony and let God handle the timing of things.

      1. Thank you for your honest reply! Sorry that my question was out of place in this article. I guess the excitement of all the things im learning through you distracted me from the point of the article and made me focus on having the honor to just speak to you. Blessings to you and thank you so much for taking the time to share all the gems that the Lord is revealing through you.

  8. Knowing that the AC have two spirits inside, that of the man and that of the Beast, I’ve been wondering if the two spirits will communicate with each other, or if the Beast will overwhelm the man. It would seem the latter is true, right? Because the Beast will receive instant judgment while the man must wait for a millennium.

      1. Ah, yes. That makes more sense. But then what do you think about this spiritual possession? Will the Man still be conscious and has a say in making decisions? Or will everything after the start of the possession be the responsibility of the Beast? Weird question, I know. I was wondering about freewill and all that, and about whether God will still give the chance to the Man to not become the AC, like Jesus did with Judas…

        1. Any part of a man’s psyche that is not surrendered to God’s Spirit is open to demonic influence. In an unsaved person this is the entire psyche. Will Satan make the AC the same deal he tried to make with Jesus? To show him the kingdoms of the world in exchange for worship? I think so. Also how does the apparent death of the Beast play into all of this. Many parts of this are foggy and unclear. But it will be a great delusion.

          1. I didn’t think of that! The AC saying yes to all that Jesus rejected sounds like a terrifying start of a horror movie. Well of course it does, it’s the prequel to the Great Tribulation, ha ha ha! Thanks for your thoughts on this Nelson.

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